Embracing Real Bonds in an Online World

Gather round the crackling warmth of Lobow's lakeside retreat, where Lobow & UP4thechallenge peel back the layers of our podcasting adventure, one reflection at a time.  We examine the contrast between the tangible vibrancy of recording side by side and the sometimes sterile touch of podcasting across the digital divide. It's a heartfelt interlude that meanders through the realms of mental health (specifically ADHD, Autism, and OCD), the pursuit of control, and the subtle ways these forces shape our friendships and the very essence of our show. Sit with us as we unravel the complexities of maintaining authenticity in a world where online personas often overshadow real-life identities, discussing the nuanced ballet of social adaptability that we all perform.

As the embers of our conversation glow, we pivot to the sanctuaries of comfort and understanding within our relationships, both virtual and in the flesh. Here, we navigate the choppy waters of being misconstrued, championing the cause for empathy in recognizing the diverse mental landscapes that make us uniquely ourselves. Whether it's feeling misunderstood based on outward appearances or negotiating the dynamics of a partnership where one thrives online, this episode is a mosaic of our personal experiences and insights. Join us as we toast to the new year and the enduring power of connection that binds us all.

Lobow’s SPARK is proudly supported by Leo Guinan, Kirk Hofstrom, Casey Elliot, Sarah Delano, Justin Allingham, Blushing Crafter, Jamie Young, and Beth Jones.  It is also supported by 10 anonymous supporters.  Whether you want to be mentioned by name or remain anonymous, this podcast does not exist without you.  Thank you so much for your support.

Lobow’s SPARK has started a fundraising effort for Crisis Text Line. We have a goal of $19 per episode as $19 supports one person in their time of absolute crisis with their mental health. If you would like to donate through our fundraiser in titled “Lauren’s Infinity”, the link is listed below.
https://www.classy.org/fundraiser/3638033  

The background music during the recognition parts of this episode, was written by Guy Farmer.  Look him up on Itunes!!

MERCHANDISE NOW AVAILABLE! This is a work in progress but tell me what you want, and I will make it happen!  https://lobowspark.myshopify.com

Chapters

• 0:00 The Importance of Friendship in Podcasting
• 15:07 Online Persona vs Real Life Identities
• 29:12 Comfort and Understanding in Relationships

Transcript

Up4thechallenge: 0:00

I am currently in a lake house with Lobow, so I am here in the US. We've been here for the past 19 days, so I've been here for Christmas and now until New Year as well. It's the first time we've met in real life. You know what? It's probably a good idea that we actually do a podcast together given that's how we met. So Cheers, Cheers indeed 100%.

Lobow: 0:31

No, it's good, it's fun to pursue this because it's honestly. That's the whole premise of my belief is that friendship matters. That's literally my entire concept. So we're friends, we're hanging out, we're having a drink, we're on fire.

Up4thechallenge: 0:47

That's it.

Lobow: 0:48

That's all it is.

Up4thechallenge: 0:50

So the last podcast, at least on your channel, is people talking about the stress of Christmas and it's just a bunch of people hanging out anyway. But it's quite nice the difference of the different podcasts, like that for yours.

Lobow: 1:03

Because it fits it does, Because I'm not here to tell anyone how to do anything or to say oh, by the way, you have this and I can diagnose this and I can tell you why this is happening. All I do is just show up and tell you I love you and let things out.

Up4thechallenge: 1:20

That's literally all it is. Yeah, I mean for me it's different. I mean, this type of podcast where I'm in person is definitely different. Well, it's happened once more, once before.

Lobow: 1:32

My first one was with gu Barber.

Up4thechallenge: 1:35

Where we were on. You've done it a couple of times, though haven't you?

Lobow: 1:38

Twice Mark and Doc f ?

Up4thechallenge: 1:40

Yeah, and that's so. The go checks those podcasts out. They are in the playlist.

Lobow: 1:48

It's way more difficult because it's interaction, instead of staring at a screen where it Obviously you have all the technology and all this kind of stuff. Now you actually have to communicate with a human being. See, that thing is no. That thing is no no, I think it's a that doesn't bother me as much.

Up4thechallenge: 2:05

It's genuinely. It's a fact that I can't regulate the audio. It's more about on a face-to-face. On there, I have far more control because I don't have, Because we're not. Let's be honest anyone watching this, this is being done, and any iPhone number's out there. It's sort of Samsung right. This is literally being recorded on a phone. So and last time I did it in person, it was recorded on a phone, was yours done the same way, or was it Actually?

Lobow: 2:34

the first one yes, the second one no?

Up4thechallenge: 2:36

Okay, so you record your phone, you record it again, okay, which I can do. Yes, but it's a blessing thing. It's like we're not doing what a lot of, because it's like you've got a lot of in-person products out there, obviously that spend, because it's the only thing they do. Thousands and thousands on shore mics and they have everything there. I think it's more difficult for me to that can, which I spoke about all the time on my podcast, and they have the control taken away. So it's just like I have. I can upscale some things, but some things I just have to rely on that's how it was and that kind of fishes me off, but isn't that all mental health?

Up4thechallenge: 3:19

Oh control.

Lobow: 3:19

Yes, certainly, Greg. It's all control. The second to control is ripped away in any slight way. We flip the fuck out.

Up4thechallenge: 3:27

Yeah, that's why that is, no matter what issue it is, oh yeah, and that's a massive problem.

Lobow: 3:34

If you're in a relationship, if you have friends, if they take away control for you, you're like well, what the fuck just?

Up4thechallenge: 3:41

Yeah, I'm not Because everything was going great.

Lobow: 3:44

I was going. What was it before? Right like.

Up4thechallenge: 3:47

This is the funny thing, because your big thing with me a lot is that you know I have the answers to questions and things like that.

Up4thechallenge: 3:53

Yeah, but I have to say this to you before Like I got told years ago by someone I knew who's a trans-sacrifice and psychologist, that I was the biggest control freak he's ever known. Right, because when I get into a conversation, if I didn't know the answer, I'd go away and learn it inside out or do a qualification in it, right? So that's why I end up knowing things. It's probably because at some point I knew fuck all about it. I was like, no, I can't. No, no, can't do that. It's like I think what it is. It's a more extreme version of Joey's from Friends. There's an episode of Friends where Joey is Pendulette, the magician. Pendulette is his only cameo, I think, in Friends and he comes in and is trying to sell him in psychopedias and he talks about the fact of like, have there been situations when your friends are talking where you haven't known what they're talking about, and it's like that's what it is for me. It's like I didn't know that that's never happening again, right?

Lobow: 4:52

That can be a good thing is when you realize like I'm never going to let that happen again.

Up4thechallenge: 4:56

I need to know this.

Lobow: 4:59

I think it's probably because of how much talk it's is. It happens to me Clearly what happened is?

Up4thechallenge: 5:04

it happened to God damn much for me. When I was younger, when I was a kid, I played a big fuck.

Lobow: 5:09

all it's fun for me on this podcast actually is to be in real life Like. This is the most relaxed I could be. When you get me on a fucking Zoom call and I'm worried about Wi-Fi and all this kind of shit, I'm panicking. I'm doing all those things right now. I'm comfortable with shit.

Up4thechallenge: 5:26

And this is why people think you're so much older than me.

Lobow: 5:28

We're basically the same age by the way.

Up4thechallenge: 5:32

I know some of you are now putting your glasses on the check, but I'm a lot more weathered.

Lobow: 5:38

Okay, you can say that.

Up4thechallenge: 5:41

Clearly I was wearing moisturizer when I was on the streets. I don't know what the fuck happened.

Lobow: 5:44

Oh Jesus, yeah, I mean I don't know, I just feel more.

Up4thechallenge: 5:51

But then I'm far more reclusive, right. So I'm, and I mean during the lockdown I completely went online. Yeah, so like immediately went online and I suppose I caught myself all of that immediately and I'd be doing computers since I was like secondary school, right, so I guess I just I could speed up to the to that quicker. Yeah, that's why I'm like, yeah, I can do this, Because I was on, I was on calls from like dang it, I mean as soon as it was comfortable.

Lobow: 6:22

it's comfortable to have that separation when, if it's online, you're not entirely obligated to that scenario. So there's no risk of you know this person cares about me. I can't you know I could upset them. I could not upset them. You know, if I make a mistake I can apologize. They can accept the apology. That online there's a screen that separates you. I think it's making it nice that I am. I don't think I'll give a fuck. I think you're the nicest fucking loving person I've ever met.

Up4thechallenge: 6:59

Instead of earlier, when we don't diagnose delusion, that's when. There's disorders.

Lobow: 7:04

I'm sure some of you've been through. There's a certain great point to this is when you're separated by a screen. That isn't real life. Until it is real life, oh I see, it's just not a still real life thing? Well, it is, but until you actually meet that person face to face, you don't really know.

Up4thechallenge: 7:28

You do sound like someone's granddad now.

Lobow: 7:30

Because I think, hey, where's the border? I'm a granddad, okay.

Up4thechallenge: 7:35

Probably the right age for a granddad in Florida.

Up4thechallenge: 7:39

I think it's more about. So for me, there's no difference to me at all between in real life and online, especially after lockdown. I mean, there's people who basically started relationships and they have become married because of it. You don't Right, but it's a bit In the same way. If you're going to use that as a qualifier, I'd say the same argument can be had for people that are in a relationship but they don't know until they live together. If we use that qualifier, I'll agree with that, okay.

Lobow: 8:11

So my point to that is you do make a good point. It is real. However, that's also like saying that you know if you get into a relationship online with no woman or whoever your preferred partner is and all that it's not the same as having sex in real life.

Up4thechallenge: 8:32

But then what if it's? But that's not what we're talking about.

Lobow: 8:36

Well, if you need someone in real life, it is way different than seeing them on screen. That is like. So, Pamela Anderson I was a huge fan. Okay, Huge fan, I mean I love her. I think she's hot as Hot as shit. But I mean she's way different from me staring at her on her computer screen and then having her sit here in front of me. You've got to understand that sexual tension.

Up4thechallenge: 8:58

That's different what. I'm saying is Nah, that's reality versus that's. Sexual tension versus real life sexual tension that's not the same. What I'm saying is you're being very specific about almost sexualized versions of it in real life.

Lobow: 9:14

Well that's exactly the only option that I can see as a.

Up4thechallenge: 9:18

I'm not sleeping at any level. Okay, I'm just saying.

Lobow: 9:24

What I'm saying is that's why my wife gets us.

Up4thechallenge: 9:27

What I'm saying is if you have so if you have someone that you, let's say you have someone that's I don't know, you go to the pub every day, right English? Yes, if you go to pub every day and you meet someone, you say hello, end of the bar, you know, and there's no fucking hugging, there's no you have the same language as the set of you.

Lobow: 9:48

No, like, for example, the pub, maybe in the north of.

Up4thechallenge: 9:51

England, but not in the south of England. You went up to someone and you're like you're all right, you probably get punched. So I mean it's very different.

Lobow: 10:01

So that was the only example I can think of as separating it up the future real life from the actual real life. That was my only example.

Up4thechallenge: 10:14

To me, the only qualifier I agree with to me is if, like I said, if you have friends or a relationship that you wait from oh, we've been together since my first time to now, we live together and so many people suddenly go oh, my god, I fucking hate you Because it's gone from. Oh, you know, we saw each other every day, every other day, right, and now I have to actually see what you're like Like.

Lobow: 10:39

No, no, that fair, okay, that could be, and I think that that's a huge qualifier in terms of like. Who you want to actually, you know, devote a lot of time to is someone, whether it's a friend, a lover, a wife, girlfriend, whoever it is. If you can get to know that person on an actual level, then you know it's, it's worth your time.

Up4thechallenge: 11:04

But and so that would be the online first Right. No, no.

Lobow: 11:08

I'm not saying online I was qualified, not correctly what I mean is like you are every bit of yourself in real life as you are online, and I know that now. Well, when you meet someone in real life like I did, Leo, they're the exact same.

Up4thechallenge: 11:30

Look at the playlist, but all of the what's up with that.

Lobow: 11:35

Promotion You're always promoting.

Up4thechallenge: 11:38

And now meeting you.

Lobow: 11:39

You're saying too, and so that gives me comfort to go online again and say you know what I want to talk to this person and you know what I want to fucking meet that person.

Up4thechallenge: 11:48

But does that not just go against the point you just made?

Lobow: 11:51

Yes, it does, but that's what I do.

Up4thechallenge: 11:54

I go get my, you all get yourself, I get myself, yes, yes absolutely A percent of the time because it lies.

Lobow: 11:59

I can argue with myself, I can't argue with anyone else, let's fuck it.

Up4thechallenge: 12:03

Just use the line that I taught you no, no, no. No, no, that was brilliant Now in the argument against yourself, so that you can know you're an originally one.

Lobow: 12:14

Anyway, I know that I got into it all I sort it, sort it.

Up4thechallenge: 12:17

The only thing he's remembered in a while. He thought it was the line. That's why, yeah, online friendships and online whatever. I think if we'd have, come back.

Lobow: 12:28

Oh and Dave, sorry Dave, my dick went down here. It is time, once again, to thank this podcast's biggest supporters. Without you Okay, yeah, I'm trying to do two things at once here here, hey Santa Without you, this podcast does not exist. So thank you, leo Guynam, thank you Kirk Hofstrom, thank you Casey Elliott, thank you Sarah Delano, thank you Justin Allingham, thank you Blush and Crafter, thank you Jamie Young and thank you, beth Jones. Without y'all, this podcast cannot exist.

Up4thechallenge: 13:14

And again the same. It's all of the e-mics on the cameras. Guys just saying and so am I Well anyone that thinks I'm like five, six, anyone that still watches me from Twitch. We've got some of you. Thank you, it's good to know the 100 little wood is still around, so thank you very much. If you are watching this, say hi, I am six too. Okay, actually, stand up, let's go. I am not fucking sure, all right, okay, good, I'm glad either.

Lobow: 13:41

Yeah.

Up4thechallenge: 13:44

Yeah, it's like no, I'm not six, but this one is. But, yeah, so I am not as a small little bit, but yeah, it's interesting. I think. If you went back five, 10 years, I think it's very different because people didn't use the internet and online as saying right, even like it wasn't the same. I think Zoom and, to a lesser extent, skype, I think because of COVID, has completely changed how we use and Twitch being live streaming, it's just. It really changes how we interact because we are more, we're more just chatting to someone now. Yeah, rather than the past. Well, I think it was a lot different.

Lobow: 14:31

It's good to talk If you're on my podcast tonight.

Up4thechallenge: 14:35

If you're in his podcast, go and check out his good stuff podcast it will be in the link below.

Lobow: 14:41

But it's a brilliant title. It's good to talk. That title alone is what I feel, is the most important thing. It's efficient. Talk to each other. Don't try to save each other, just try to be there If anyone wants to use YouTube.

Up4thechallenge: 15:00

If you get it as a channel, I will subscribe because YouTube's really good at swearing and built fucking free.

Lobow: 15:07

But I mean, both of us hide behind certain things. I hide behind the fact that you know I'm still not over that issue from a couple years back and now I'm killing myself. You know helping. If you hide behind the fact that, in my opinion, that people can't love me, I'm amazing, but he won't admit it. I will not admit it and that's the hardest thing. So did you, but you're not getting it wrong, I mean, I mean.

Up4thechallenge: 15:46

I'm not fucking fool.

Lobow: 15:49

Yeah, everyone hides behind something, Well, everyone presents.

Up4thechallenge: 15:53

I mean, I've said this a lot, no matter who you are, everyone kind of masks to a point anyway.

Up4thechallenge: 16:01

Yeah, and even if they like as well. I've always hated this. Oh, I'm the same person in your life as I am online. No, you're not, and I just you're not because you may seem and there may be a lot of it, but that may also mean that anybody else you mask the same way, and I think when people hear me say that they take it the wrong way. If you go to the shop, you will give a persona to that person at the shop, differently than you give to the barman at the pub you go to, to your I don't know your bookie, to your friends you give a different face, and so this idea of like I'll know everything that I give out online is nice. That's the point. I've heard that one.

Lobow: 16:51

It's not making. Yeah, I've heard that one. Everything you put out online is a face. The face isn't real.

Up4thechallenge: 16:59

No, but the face to face isn't real either.

Lobow: 17:04

Okay, good point that give up on this topic.

Up4thechallenge: 17:07

The thing in real life is can be just as the thing is, is that. What I hate is to call it because it's not fake, and I know that's what people will say is, oh, you're just saying online is fake, then, or you put the face forward. But that's also the argument that every neurotypical puts against neurodivergent. Correct Masking doesn't mean fake. It just means that it's the easiest way for you to interact with that community, that social event, because that's the best way that your mind can cope with it.

Lobow: 17:37

Correct. However, as much as it might be an impossible goal, I like impossible, so I'm going to meet everyone that I've spoken with in real life. Yeah, I mean like if I tell you online on a zoom call on a thing. Hey, by the way, you have ADHD, you have autism, you have OCD, you have this and you're struggling. Sit there with you, and I will sit there with you in real life also.

Up4thechallenge: 18:11

Yeah.

Lobow: 18:11

I don't have issues.

Up4thechallenge: 18:12

I think the thing is the thing we need to think is that the online thing. We don't need to think of it as fake or fake personas, because I think a lot of online people get that. I mean, think of your favorite YouTuber. Nine times out of ten, everyone's just like oh well, they like that because they're shut up.

Up4thechallenge: 18:33

They don't they are. But also in real life people are going to be in Spain and if in real life you know because again, autism, adhd, ocd, depression, whatever it is so many times get told I'll beat your faking them because you're masking, it's not, that's not what it is. Oh, no, I know. But so many times people have told that as well, because it's like, oh, but if it's not user, that's not the case.

Up4thechallenge: 18:59

I actually think that neurotypicals, in terms of day to day life, probably mask more than your end of virgin. A hundred percent, too, pussy ass, to fucking say it Exactly Because they'll go into the world and treat them. This is the difference.

Lobow: 19:12

So that's how you've got neurodivergence.

Up4thechallenge: 19:15

You are less likely to buddy up with your boss because you need to. You're more likely to turn the fuck off if they can get your nerves, but a lot of other people will just, you know, buddy up on it. You know that's the bullshit about it.

Lobow: 19:33

Neurodivirals power trick, neurodivergence lead. There's a huge difference in those two things. I try my best not to you try, but you do. I'll start the fucking back.

Up4thechallenge: 19:46

Someone else got the reins, got dammit.

Lobow: 19:51

Yeah, I'd rather not, but anyone better not to do it. There's now people out there going.

Up4thechallenge: 19:56

Oh, but you wasn't charged.

Lobow: 19:57

That's because you fuckers don't step up, right, that's because you fucking per se. That's the entire point.

Up4thechallenge: 20:04

Yeah, I mean so I think there's a thing about relationships. I think the thing we just all need to get used to is that all of us are going to put on a little bit of bullshit. It's time to time, no matter what it is, because we need to for ourselves. That is not someone lying. It's just someone trying to not feel uncomfortable.

Lobow: 20:25

Right.

Up4thechallenge: 20:26

And I think that's where a lot of it comes from. But unfortunately, because of the online world, it's been moved over to our people online and on real, often neurodivergent. Well, they're just lazy and lying, and that's the thing.

Lobow: 20:38

But isn't that a little bit dangerous in some ways? If you're only comfortable online, did you just stay online forever instead of getting out into the real world? To me that's a little bit dangerous. There's two things.

Up4thechallenge: 20:54

I've issued. There's one I think the real world can be online and two, but two also for some people. For some people, they're far better online, hey.

Lobow: 21:06

I've done it and that's the thing. That's the whole premise. Yeah, it's whatever works for you. Whatever works for you. Did you fucking do it? Yeah?

Up4thechallenge: 21:13

well, I'll go back to the thing Again. Anybody from the 100-lip of words again, thank you, I think. Well, I used to say what works for you works for you. It sounded like my stupid life.

Lobow: 21:23

It's true, but if it works for you then why would you do something? Else.

Up4thechallenge: 21:26

It was also why maybe we should try and change certain people with mental health issues behavior to suit what you think is normal. I'm looking at a few psychologists in America that can't be being sued Anyway.

Lobow: 21:40

But let's get all over America for this. No, no, it's just that they're the ones being sued the most. I think, again what you mean. But I think we have, as you said, that's my biggest weakness. I know what to say and I can't say it well. Well, it's not just that, I think there's also a bias for you. You do have a bias against the kind of what I have a bias against is people literally saying in front of the computer screen for days on end doing absolutely.

Up4thechallenge: 22:17

Like yes, they might not be doing that, they're helping.

Lobow: 22:22

They're doing great things, but that's the second. They start to get away from that computer and they go out into the real world where relationships actually, like you can't just click the X button, like you can't just say in cult.

Up4thechallenge: 22:36

That's called an Irish goodbye.

Lobow: 22:40

You see, I point on this that matters.

Up4thechallenge: 22:43

So like social skills do at some point matter, and I swear to you, everyone has ever met me going in total and that. But then there's definitely two of them. Everyone in the? U is fucking mad. However, however when I'm back at home, I walk out my door, I go to the shop and then I'll come home. I'll do that and then I'll come out.

Up4thechallenge: 23:05

And no one knows where I live because they don't need to. So I am the other side of it. I am far more comfortable in front of my screen, so I like being outside, but I feel comfortable in front of my screen, right, because that's. I don't have to deal with other people judging, assuming I just deal with what I want. I want to watch on YouTube the work I need to do doing a podcast. I have the control and the assumptions of others are things that I've had to deal with my entire life, because it's quite exciting when I talk Because of whatever I have an assumption online, because I get to press the red button and tell them to fuck off. Right, and that's why in real life, if something happens, I walk away, I disappear, because why do I have to put up with it? Just because they want to have what you call real life is for me.

Lobow: 24:02

You know what I am calling real life?

Up4thechallenge: 24:04

I don't know, because online can be real life too. So it is what you are calling real life.

Lobow: 24:08

Because you specify the things. This is where you get a little bit defensive. No, no, no, no, matt, it's not the thing.

Up4thechallenge: 24:16

It comes down to actual people. No, because you specify outside as real life. You specify that I can rewind it and play it for the other person.

Lobow: 24:24

No, no that's 100% fine. But what you should notice is that when I say those things, it's not what I actually that doesn't mean that you should be smart enough to be able to read.

Up4thechallenge: 24:35

Well, I don't agree with that Smart but anyway, there will be a book coming soon.

Up4thechallenge: 24:41

I swear to God Smart, save my shit in Amazon at some point. But what I mean is I am using that as an indicator. It's not about smart or anything else. If you give a specific, I am going to answer the specific I know. But my point is if you look at real life, if I am dealing with the outside real life, then I have to deal with that shit for too long. I don't have to. If I don't have to, why would I?

Lobow: 25:10

Because it's a good question and you're going to hate the answer. You're going to know what the answer is that I'll say it's because, would you actually get away from what's comfortable, that you actually live?

Up4thechallenge: 25:26

But I've lived fine without it. There's plenty of people, so how many of the top YouTubers do you think?

Lobow: 25:35

live.

Up4thechallenge: 25:36

My point is how many of the top YouTubers lived before they were behind the screen for?

Lobow: 25:41

Daydream. The thing is they're filming living like they're doing things outside of a suit Side men, Logan Paul, Jake Paul, all just in their own homes Right, but most like Mr Beast is your favorite.

Up4thechallenge: 26:02

Just behind the screen.

Lobow: 26:03

Well, to start, for the first eight years, to start. So then they branch out, leaving that space and going into the actual real world. And the first. Thing.

Up4thechallenge: 26:15

Mr Beast did after having a bad interaction with what look? Wait, wait, wait. My point is still. I'm still continuing. Is the first thing that the beast did because of interactions badly in the outside world, was to buy and renovate a complex in which he lives. Now he lives on his own complex, which is where they also feel Right, so he lives within that complex.

Lobow: 26:41

They feel as in his crew. But he has people around him.

Up4thechallenge: 26:48

When he wishes them to no when he wishes them to be. He lives there with security, I'm sure at some point. But he lives in there. He's got his own little. I only know about his Mr who's. The Boss went and visited. He's got his own room. He doesn't like. He has his own little room in there, sectioned off with ensuite. It's not like he's got a thing. He has them brought himself back in because that's better for him.

Up4thechallenge: 27:11

Now I'm not what I'm. What I'm not saying is that that's going to be the same for everyone. My point is you don't need to be offline to live. You don't need to be offline to see something better for some people Correct, you do Correct In the same way as for some people probably should get offline, It'll be better, Right.

Up4thechallenge: 27:32

I think, the the bad. The bad arguing is to assume that everyone needs it, and I'm not saying you're making that argument. I'm not. I'm not saying you're a couple of older mothers to say that in the comments. Your 36 year old is staying in the basement. I'm sorry, but that that's the problem. Like I, and even if you're, even if you feel that you don't need to be comfortable in the real world or whatever I wasn't comfortable for to the point where I've had a shitty time at certain times in life. I don't see the need to continue that and having to continue with. The biggest thing for me is other people's assumptions on me because of certain things. I don't need to deal with them being dicks, because any response I have to that fuels their own assumption. Right, so I'm, I'm.

Lobow: 28:21

I'm not sure, I don't know. I thought you looked like one thing really quick before we. I won't assume anything about you.

Up4thechallenge: 28:27

That's why I'm trying to advise you. I think it's fun, it's fucking fun, to hang out with you. That's why I talked to you online.

Lobow: 28:34

Now Spark has started a fundraising effort for crisis techslide. We have a goal of $19 per episode, as $19. Supports just one person in their time crisis with mental health. If you would like to donate through our fundraiser titled Warrants and Affinity, the link is listed in the episode's description. Warren was my wife's best friend and loved my all.

Up4thechallenge: 29:07

At first and now you're here at my fucking house.

Lobow: 29:12

And what's the next thing we'll be doing on the next couple of days? Talking about lunch. It's very true. It may have started online, but it's, and we'll continue so Right Until the next meetup.

Up4thechallenge: 29:25

And then until the next meetup. Until the next meetup.

Lobow: 29:27

And then we go back, right, yeah, but at the end of the day it's sustained by fun for me, yeah, whichever one is sustained by the way in which that person feels comfortable.

Up4thechallenge: 29:38

Right Is the main thing, and I feel comfortable with that. No, it's not the same. By the way, I'm not being held here, but against my will. It's fine and I'm pretty sure I could take it.

Lobow: 29:47

I mean, there is a lot of fireworks.

Up4thechallenge: 29:49

It's pretty firepower when I am in Florida, but you know it's. I think that there's some flexibility and that's fine, but that's also fine and I think that's. I think it takes a different level. I also think it's something very specific for certain mental health issues as well. Is that a level of comfortable is the best between you know, there's a version of neurotypicals that neurotypicals too often try to step over and step into. I know and that's probably where a lot of my issue comes from is they don't step into it Because it's like they don't need to act like you, they don't need to interact the way that you do, because they're not doing anything wrong, right. If they're doing something wrong, that's different, but if they're not, they're not fucking alone, they're fine. I know Parents with mental health issues.

Up4thechallenge: 30:39

Um, yeah.

Lobow: 30:41

And no, I totally agree with that and that's hurt my life immensely, is you know, people like me? It's more like oh, you should, you should do this, you should do this, Can I do this? Please do this, Please do this. My thing is they're like I don't just let me.

Up4thechallenge: 31:02

Fucking helps myself and someone else Like I'm done, like you should do this, you should do this. How is that going to change the world? It's not. I'm usually called too aggressive and I'm like.

Lobow: 31:18

It's not just because I'm big, but that's why I fucking love you is because you're so aggressive. I'm not. I know, and that's the thing I think for a lot of people, the aggressiveness you hear.

Up4thechallenge: 31:30

I'm bigger than them. That's not my fucking. That's called genetics. It's science people Learning Um.

Lobow: 31:38

I'm a self.

Up4thechallenge: 31:40

Um, I mean, it's that. That's the thing about that. It's first, it's first. I'm sure it gets Um, and it's just it. People just need to be able to come to what they are. Now, obviously, if we're talking relationships, if you've got one person online, that's so comfortable online and one person is no comfortable online. Maybe this, I mean that one that one's gonna that may. That may clash a little bit.

Lobow: 32:03

That may be a I don't know that's gonna. That's gonna struggle a bit, but it's just. You know it's being in relationships my wife is just good.

Up4thechallenge: 32:10

Yeah, we got to get to the point. So, um, I don't know. Hello, sweetheart, that was that was no point just bought off because there never is Um, but hopefully you've had a good new year.